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	<title>Comments on: The Real Kirk and Spock Would Have Fixed The Time Line</title>
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	<description>Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</description>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-226553</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 23:23:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-226553</guid>
		<description>I agree.  If Abrams wanted complete freedom to write whatever he wants, then he shouldn&#039;t  make a movie based on an existing franchise.  It seems like wants to hijack Roddenberry&#039;s fan base to bump up his numbers. Either write Star Trek as Star Trek, or create your own franchise.
If he does a new movie, it should restore the timeline.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree.  If Abrams wanted complete freedom to write whatever he wants, then he shouldn&#8217;t  make a movie based on an existing franchise.  It seems like wants to hijack Roddenberry&#8217;s fan base to bump up his numbers. Either write Star Trek as Star Trek, or create your own franchise.<br />
If he does a new movie, it should restore the timeline.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-218240</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Jul 2009 23:57:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-218240</guid>
		<description>I enjoyed the movie but did not like the inability or unwillingness to fix a wrong in the timeline. 

J. J. Abrams should have skipped the time travel and kept most of the core story and implant some  other threat, instead of time traveling drillers from Romulus.

Also i for one do not accept the old Spock from the movie, as the true timeline Spock and instead  prefer to think of him as some other timeline&#039;s spock because the real one would have done more to save Vulcan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I enjoyed the movie but did not like the inability or unwillingness to fix a wrong in the timeline. </p>
<p>J. J. Abrams should have skipped the time travel and kept most of the core story and implant some  other threat, instead of time traveling drillers from Romulus.</p>
<p>Also i for one do not accept the old Spock from the movie, as the true timeline Spock and instead  prefer to think of him as some other timeline&#8217;s spock because the real one would have done more to save Vulcan.</p>
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		<title>By: SciFi Weekend: Star Trek Timelines; Olivia Munn in Playboy; Topless Thirteen; and Kristin Bell - Liberal Values - Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-217486</link>
		<dc:creator>SciFi Weekend: Star Trek Timelines; Olivia Munn in Playboy; Topless Thirteen; and Kristin Bell - Liberal Values - Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 04:23:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-217486</guid>
		<description>[...] something changed the timeline the timeline we know was obliterated and the episode centered around restoring the original timeline. Other episodes, as in those of the Mirror Universe, showed the alternative timelines as existing [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] something changed the timeline the timeline we know was obliterated and the episode centered around restoring the original timeline. Other episodes, as in those of the Mirror Universe, showed the alternative timelines as existing [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rex</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-216439</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 03:31:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-216439</guid>
		<description>The notion of things continuing as they &quot;should&quot; be is the basis of the Prime Directive. Wouldn&#039;t restoring the time line be as important as leaving pre-warp civilizations to develop unaltered by the influence of Federation personnel?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The notion of things continuing as they &#8220;should&#8221; be is the basis of the Prime Directive. Wouldn&#8217;t restoring the time line be as important as leaving pre-warp civilizations to develop unaltered by the influence of Federation personnel?</p>
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		<title>By: SciFi Weekend: The Doctor&#8217;s Next Companion; Star Trek Sex Symbol; Summer Glau and Dollhouse - Liberal Values - Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-216358</link>
		<dc:creator>SciFi Weekend: The Doctor&#8217;s Next Companion; Star Trek Sex Symbol; Summer Glau and Dollhouse - Liberal Values - Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jun 2009 02:13:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-216358</guid>
		<description>[...] dovetailing into the beginning of the original Star Trek series but there is a problem. Abrams changed the time line in ways which prevent this from being entirely possible. I generally loved the movie and don&#8217;t [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] dovetailing into the beginning of the original Star Trek series but there is a problem. Abrams changed the time line in ways which prevent this from being entirely possible. I generally loved the movie and don&#8217;t [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-216073</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 12:59:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-216073</guid>
		<description>For point 2, Spock wanted to go off into different area as that would be the staging ground of the Fleet to counter-attack. However, the Spock at the point in time, either blinded by his anger of having to lose his world and his mum or was thinking too rigid to believe that Enterprise was capable of taking down the enemy ship (of course, with the future Spock&#039;s ship). 

Point 3. The interference generator for beaming was not on, presumably, there was no threat detected by the enemy ship (Enterprise was hiding in the clouds and as pointed out in Point 6, there was no other space defence. Most of neighboring ship got wiped out when they warped to Valcan with their shields down and got destroyed anyway.) Another possibility was that the generator was destroyed in when Kirk sky dived down to the drill at Valcan. The generator was placed at the drill. The enemy ship may not have the parts to replace the generator. And apparently, the enemy ship had no shields, and I presumed that the enemy ship relied heavily on active weaponery and the generator to prevent boarding attempts. They didn&#039;t beam more than 2 people into the ship as it was supposed to be a stealth mission with primary objectives to rescue the captain and stop Nero.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For point 2, Spock wanted to go off into different area as that would be the staging ground of the Fleet to counter-attack. However, the Spock at the point in time, either blinded by his anger of having to lose his world and his mum or was thinking too rigid to believe that Enterprise was capable of taking down the enemy ship (of course, with the future Spock&#8217;s ship). </p>
<p>Point 3. The interference generator for beaming was not on, presumably, there was no threat detected by the enemy ship (Enterprise was hiding in the clouds and as pointed out in Point 6, there was no other space defence. Most of neighboring ship got wiped out when they warped to Valcan with their shields down and got destroyed anyway.) Another possibility was that the generator was destroyed in when Kirk sky dived down to the drill at Valcan. The generator was placed at the drill. The enemy ship may not have the parts to replace the generator. And apparently, the enemy ship had no shields, and I presumed that the enemy ship relied heavily on active weaponery and the generator to prevent boarding attempts. They didn&#8217;t beam more than 2 people into the ship as it was supposed to be a stealth mission with primary objectives to rescue the captain and stop Nero.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-216071</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 12:41:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-216071</guid>
		<description>There was no space defence for the 2 planets because, (pardon my memory), the Star Fleet was stretched thin by its own mission to make contact (peacefully or otherwise) with new space traveling civilisations. The only defences that were emplaced where there were wars going on, or at the borders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There was no space defence for the 2 planets because, (pardon my memory), the Star Fleet was stretched thin by its own mission to make contact (peacefully or otherwise) with new space traveling civilisations. The only defences that were emplaced where there were wars going on, or at the borders.</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Kevin Ong, M.D.</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-225576</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Kevin Ong, M.D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 07:28:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-225576</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;says The Real Kirk and Spock would have fixed the Star Trek timeline http://tr.im/moRX (Spoilers!)&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/drdollars/status/1921403761&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">says The Real Kirk and Spock would have fixed the Star Trek timeline <a href="http://tr.im/moRX" rel="nofollow">http://tr.im/moRX</a> (Spoilers!)</span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/drdollars/status/1921403761">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375">Topsy page</a>]</div>
<p></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Ron Chusid</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215692</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Chusid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 00:05:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215692</guid>
		<description>There are certainly tons of holes in the plot--which we generally ignore and enjoy the movie. Besides the issues I&#039;ve already mentioned in posts, 6 bothered me the most. (I&#039;m already accustomed to the idea of beaming a small number often with the captain, and then ignoring the potential abilities of a transporter, or of virtually anyone winding up at the helm). It is certainly hard to believe that a ship could send down such a drill and nobody on the planet is trying to destroy it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are certainly tons of holes in the plot&#8211;which we generally ignore and enjoy the movie. Besides the issues I&#8217;ve already mentioned in posts, 6 bothered me the most. (I&#8217;m already accustomed to the idea of beaming a small number often with the captain, and then ignoring the potential abilities of a transporter, or of virtually anyone winding up at the helm). It is certainly hard to believe that a ship could send down such a drill and nobody on the planet is trying to destroy it.</p>
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		<title>By: Fritz</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215689</link>
		<dc:creator>Fritz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 23:40:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215689</guid>
		<description>I just saw the flick.

Very enjoyable.  Fine.

However, the things that annoyed me were not the time travel issues.  They were basic tactical issues.  OK -- and one bio issue.

1.  Bio issue.  I don&#039;t buy the extra-big creature on the damn ice field.  I don&#039;t think the energy balance is going to work.

2.  Tactics.  A really bad-ass spaceship is heading to Earth after having clobbered Vulcan and Spock is going to have the Enterprise go wandering off in a different direction?  Um, no.

3.  Tactics.  If you can beam 2 guys onto the enemy ship (and how did they manage that?) why don&#039;t you keep beaming more fighters in until you are stopped?  And start with more than 2.

4.  Security.  Your Joe Random Starship Captain is going to have the sooper-sekrit defense codes?  I do not think so.

5.  Chain of command.  Captain, acting captains, and whoever else has the helm running off of the bridge.   Don&#039;t people get court-martialed for stuff like that?

6.  Space defenses.  Hey -- what a concept.  Earth and Vulcan sure could use them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just saw the flick.</p>
<p>Very enjoyable.  Fine.</p>
<p>However, the things that annoyed me were not the time travel issues.  They were basic tactical issues.  OK &#8212; and one bio issue.</p>
<p>1.  Bio issue.  I don&#8217;t buy the extra-big creature on the damn ice field.  I don&#8217;t think the energy balance is going to work.</p>
<p>2.  Tactics.  A really bad-ass spaceship is heading to Earth after having clobbered Vulcan and Spock is going to have the Enterprise go wandering off in a different direction?  Um, no.</p>
<p>3.  Tactics.  If you can beam 2 guys onto the enemy ship (and how did they manage that?) why don&#8217;t you keep beaming more fighters in until you are stopped?  And start with more than 2.</p>
<p>4.  Security.  Your Joe Random Starship Captain is going to have the sooper-sekrit defense codes?  I do not think so.</p>
<p>5.  Chain of command.  Captain, acting captains, and whoever else has the helm running off of the bridge.   Don&#8217;t people get court-martialed for stuff like that?</p>
<p>6.  Space defenses.  Hey &#8212; what a concept.  Earth and Vulcan sure could use them.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Chusid</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215683</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Chusid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 21:51:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215683</guid>
		<description>I assume that old Spock didn&#039;t know the planet would be destroyed until it happened. That still doesn&#039;t explain why he stayed on his own, but if he knew of the plans he would have had more reason to try to contact Star Fleet. 

Until someone actually travels in time this is all speculative. Star Trek takes many liberties in many areas of science. For them to have their own rules for time travel is less of a problem than many of the other scientific errors. It is valid to discuss time travel in ST based upon ST&#039;s rules for time travel even if many physicists have a different view.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I assume that old Spock didn&#8217;t know the planet would be destroyed until it happened. That still doesn&#8217;t explain why he stayed on his own, but if he knew of the plans he would have had more reason to try to contact Star Fleet. </p>
<p>Until someone actually travels in time this is all speculative. Star Trek takes many liberties in many areas of science. For them to have their own rules for time travel is less of a problem than many of the other scientific errors. It is valid to discuss time travel in ST based upon ST&#8217;s rules for time travel even if many physicists have a different view.</p>
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		<title>By: Lucaswis</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215681</link>
		<dc:creator>Lucaswis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 21:44:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215681</guid>
		<description>Michio Kaku explains time travel as only being possible backwards imagining time is a river and travel back would be through a whirlpool of sorts.  And and changes would just create a fork in the river and yes old and young Spohk can live together.  But why did old Spohk just stay on the frozen planet and not contact the Federation or his Planet?  He could of had a chance at living inside of an alternate timeline (a fork in the river) with his younger self and his entire Planet... This is why time travel movies will struggle to be perfect.  Too hard to stay interesting and mainstream while holding to physics principles and common sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michio Kaku explains time travel as only being possible backwards imagining time is a river and travel back would be through a whirlpool of sorts.  And and changes would just create a fork in the river and yes old and young Spohk can live together.  But why did old Spohk just stay on the frozen planet and not contact the Federation or his Planet?  He could of had a chance at living inside of an alternate timeline (a fork in the river) with his younger self and his entire Planet&#8230; This is why time travel movies will struggle to be perfect.  Too hard to stay interesting and mainstream while holding to physics principles and common sense.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Chusid</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215531</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Chusid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 15:05:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215531</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think they will fix the time line. The reason for changing the time line is so that Abrams will be free to do anything. From his perspective this is good as he can have drama over whether a character will be killed, and he is not tied to virtually anything from the original shows. He made a point of emphasizing this both by having Spock outright say things have changed for everyone from their previous path and by making such a drastic change in the ST universe.

Abrams intentionally set this up so that he can do whatever he wants in future movies. This freedom is helpful to Abrams in making movies, and perhaps we have to accept this as the cost of getting new movies. It is bad for ST in the long run, assuming that there will be more Star Trek in the future beyond Abrams&#039; movies. 

I wouldn&#039;t mind having two versions of the Kirk Enterprise (original and Abrams) if he had limited his changes to that era. I wish he hadn&#039;t made such a drastic change which affects not only new versions of TOS but all versions of ST.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think they will fix the time line. The reason for changing the time line is so that Abrams will be free to do anything. From his perspective this is good as he can have drama over whether a character will be killed, and he is not tied to virtually anything from the original shows. He made a point of emphasizing this both by having Spock outright say things have changed for everyone from their previous path and by making such a drastic change in the ST universe.</p>
<p>Abrams intentionally set this up so that he can do whatever he wants in future movies. This freedom is helpful to Abrams in making movies, and perhaps we have to accept this as the cost of getting new movies. It is bad for ST in the long run, assuming that there will be more Star Trek in the future beyond Abrams&#8217; movies. </p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t mind having two versions of the Kirk Enterprise (original and Abrams) if he had limited his changes to that era. I wish he hadn&#8217;t made such a drastic change which affects not only new versions of TOS but all versions of ST.</p>
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		<title>By: Keith</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375&#038;cpage=1#comment-215529</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 14:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=8375#comment-215529</guid>
		<description>Well said, if they make a sequel it has to be about fixing the timeline  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said, if they make a sequel it has to be about fixing the timeline </p>
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