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	<title>Comments on: Obama and Clinton Back Dodd&#8217;s Filibuster of Telecommunications Immunity</title>
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	<description>Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</description>
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		<title>By: Irregular Times: News Unfit for Print &#187; Will Barack Obama Stand for Change Really, Or Just Rhetorically?</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296&#038;cpage=1#comment-168589</link>
		<dc:creator>Irregular Times: News Unfit for Print &#187; Will Barack Obama Stand for Change Really, Or Just Rhetorically?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2008 14:09:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296#comment-168589</guid>
		<description>[...] It involves a lot of &#8220;Stand for Change&#8221; events, doesn&#8217;t it? The thing is, way back in October of 2007 Barack Obama committed to Stand for Change in reality, not just rhetoric. The Obama campaign committed back in October of 2007 to support Senator Christopher Dodd&#8217;s efforts to stop the FISA Amendments Act, including support for a filibuster. And yesterday, Barack Obama reiterated his commitment, saying: I strongly oppose retroactive immunity in the FISA bill. No one should get a free pass to violate the basic civil liberties of the American people — not the president of the United States, and not the telecommunications companies that fell in line with his warrantless surveillance program&#8230; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] It involves a lot of &#8220;Stand for Change&#8221; events, doesn&#8217;t it? The thing is, way back in October of 2007 Barack Obama committed to Stand for Change in reality, not just rhetoric. The Obama campaign committed back in October of 2007 to support Senator Christopher Dodd&#8217;s efforts to stop the FISA Amendments Act, including support for a filibuster. And yesterday, Barack Obama reiterated his commitment, saying: I strongly oppose retroactive immunity in the FISA bill. No one should get a free pass to violate the basic civil liberties of the American people — not the president of the United States, and not the telecommunications companies that fell in line with his warrantless surveillance program&#8230; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Irregular Times: News Unfit for Print &#187; ACLU: Clinton and Obama Must Keep Promise to Stop FISA Amendments Act</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296&#038;cpage=1#comment-168230</link>
		<dc:creator>Irregular Times: News Unfit for Print &#187; ACLU: Clinton and Obama Must Keep Promise to Stop FISA Amendments Act</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 20:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296#comment-168230</guid>
		<description>[...] Senator Barack Obama&#8217;s staff made the following commitment, also in October of 2007: Senator Obama has serious concerns about many provisions in this bill, especially the provision on giving retroactive immunity to the telephone companies. He is hopeful that this bill can be improved by the Senate Judiciary Committee. But if the bill comes to the Senate floor in its current form, he would support a filibuster of it. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Senator Barack Obama&#8217;s staff made the following commitment, also in October of 2007: Senator Obama has serious concerns about many provisions in this bill, especially the provision on giving retroactive immunity to the telephone companies. He is hopeful that this bill can be improved by the Senate Judiciary Committee. But if the bill comes to the Senate floor in its current form, he would support a filibuster of it. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Lev</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296&#038;cpage=1#comment-127923</link>
		<dc:creator>Lev</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:25:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=2296#comment-127923</guid>
		<description>Typical fake opposition Dems, rolling over on command. Look at how they pretend to oppose the illegal war in Iraq, yet keep on funding it.

I am sick to death of hearing the fake opposition Dems in Congress moan about not having enough votes to end the war in Iraq. They give lip service to the myth that the only way to end the war is to write a bill saying &quot;the war is now over&quot; and send it to Bush for a prompt veto, then override the veto. They then throw up their hands, saying &quot;Well, as you can see, we don&#039;t have the votes to override any veto, so there&#039;s no way to end the war. Sorry folks.&quot;

This is disingenious and vividly illustrates who the Dems are really serving: the establishment, not their constituents.

Here&#039;s how to end the war: No bill specifically ending the war is even necessary. Remember those supplemental funding bills the Cheney regime has to constantly ask for, to continue funding the Iraq war piecemeal instead of in yearly lump sums attached to the actual defense budget? That&#039;s the achilles&#039; heel of their war effort. The next time Bush asks for another $80 billion or whatever to keep the Iraq bloodbath going, all the Democrats have to do to end the war is to say: NO. To say &quot;We won&#039;t allocate one more penny for your illegal war&quot;. Last I checked the Dems have a wafer-thin majority in both houses. With no Dems voting for the next spending bill it won&#039;t be passed and thus it won&#039;t make it to Bush&#039;s desk for signing. Bush (and especially his puppetmaster Cheney) may have concentrated an inordinate amount of power in the hands of the executive branch, but even they can&#039;t send spending bills to their own desk. That necessarily has to come from Congress. If it never reaches his desk he can&#039;t sign it, and will have 2 choices: 1.pull the troops out while there is still enough money left in the pipeline so to speak to allow an orderly withdrawl (and anyone who has five or more brain cells knows that the money isn&#039;t going to run out the next day, that&#039;s a non-issue that the right wing tries to use as a scare tactic but it is ridiculously dumbed down and simply not true; they don&#039;t wait until they have $5 left before asking for another supplemental OK?); or 2.don&#039;t pull them out right away, and leave them to wither on the vine in Iraq until the money DOES completely run out and they have to withdraw from Iraq chaotically, burning their supplies and vehicles. Either way the war will end pretty soon if the Dems refuse to vote on supplementals. They don&#039;t have to write a bill saying they are cutting off funding; this is only a fig leaf so they can pretend to be doing something to end the war when all they are doing is purposely spinning their wheels. All they have to do is to NOT VOTE ON SUPPLEMENTALS. Pretty effing simple. The people NOW need to DEMAND in so many words that if the Democrats are a genuine opposition party that they will carry out the will of the people and NOT VOTE on supplementals. If they are a fake opposition party as I feel they are, and are acting not in the people&#039;s interest but playing for the same team as the Republicans, then continue with more of the same hand-wringing and impotent nonbinding resolutions that resolve nothing. Decision time Democrats. Which are you? Genuine? Or fake opposition? I think I already know the answer to that one but why don&#039;t you surprise me?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Typical fake opposition Dems, rolling over on command. Look at how they pretend to oppose the illegal war in Iraq, yet keep on funding it.</p>
<p>I am sick to death of hearing the fake opposition Dems in Congress moan about not having enough votes to end the war in Iraq. They give lip service to the myth that the only way to end the war is to write a bill saying &#8220;the war is now over&#8221; and send it to Bush for a prompt veto, then override the veto. They then throw up their hands, saying &#8220;Well, as you can see, we don&#8217;t have the votes to override any veto, so there&#8217;s no way to end the war. Sorry folks.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is disingenious and vividly illustrates who the Dems are really serving: the establishment, not their constituents.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s how to end the war: No bill specifically ending the war is even necessary. Remember those supplemental funding bills the Cheney regime has to constantly ask for, to continue funding the Iraq war piecemeal instead of in yearly lump sums attached to the actual defense budget? That&#8217;s the achilles&#8217; heel of their war effort. The next time Bush asks for another $80 billion or whatever to keep the Iraq bloodbath going, all the Democrats have to do to end the war is to say: NO. To say &#8220;We won&#8217;t allocate one more penny for your illegal war&#8221;. Last I checked the Dems have a wafer-thin majority in both houses. With no Dems voting for the next spending bill it won&#8217;t be passed and thus it won&#8217;t make it to Bush&#8217;s desk for signing. Bush (and especially his puppetmaster Cheney) may have concentrated an inordinate amount of power in the hands of the executive branch, but even they can&#8217;t send spending bills to their own desk. That necessarily has to come from Congress. If it never reaches his desk he can&#8217;t sign it, and will have 2 choices: 1.pull the troops out while there is still enough money left in the pipeline so to speak to allow an orderly withdrawl (and anyone who has five or more brain cells knows that the money isn&#8217;t going to run out the next day, that&#8217;s a non-issue that the right wing tries to use as a scare tactic but it is ridiculously dumbed down and simply not true; they don&#8217;t wait until they have $5 left before asking for another supplemental OK?); or 2.don&#8217;t pull them out right away, and leave them to wither on the vine in Iraq until the money DOES completely run out and they have to withdraw from Iraq chaotically, burning their supplies and vehicles. Either way the war will end pretty soon if the Dems refuse to vote on supplementals. They don&#8217;t have to write a bill saying they are cutting off funding; this is only a fig leaf so they can pretend to be doing something to end the war when all they are doing is purposely spinning their wheels. All they have to do is to NOT VOTE ON SUPPLEMENTALS. Pretty effing simple. The people NOW need to DEMAND in so many words that if the Democrats are a genuine opposition party that they will carry out the will of the people and NOT VOTE on supplementals. If they are a fake opposition party as I feel they are, and are acting not in the people&#8217;s interest but playing for the same team as the Republicans, then continue with more of the same hand-wringing and impotent nonbinding resolutions that resolve nothing. Decision time Democrats. Which are you? Genuine? Or fake opposition? I think I already know the answer to that one but why don&#8217;t you surprise me?</p>
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