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	<title>Comments on: Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept</title>
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	<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/</link>
	<description>Defending Liberty and Enlightened Thought</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 06:11:23 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Bestcelebrity</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-223866</link>
		<dc:creator>Bestcelebrity</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Sep 2009 09:10:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-223866</guid>
		<description>Sure, why not? Seems that everything that&#039;s not right winged, republican, conservative, fundamental christian is socialist.
There is a phrase, at the end of the Pledge of Allegiance... &quot;with liberty and justice for all.&quot; Hhhhmmmmm to everyone who is saying this is a socialist agenda, etc., I don&#039;t see a single word in this phrase that says no liberty for gays, no liberty for lesbians. Just as the the Declaration of Independence states &quot;We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.&quot; There are no exclusions here boys and girls. As a gay man, I am a tax paying citizen of this country, tracing my family back to pre white man arriving on these shores. Give it a rest folks. For those who do not wish me to have equal rights, then fine, you pay my yearly federal and state income tax bill so I DON&#039;T have to pay for yours. End of story.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure, why not? Seems that everything that&#8217;s not right winged, republican, conservative, fundamental christian is socialist.<br />
There is a phrase, at the end of the Pledge of Allegiance&#8230; &#8220;with liberty and justice for all.&#8221; Hhhhmmmmm to everyone who is saying this is a socialist agenda, etc., I don&#8217;t see a single word in this phrase that says no liberty for gays, no liberty for lesbians. Just as the the Declaration of Independence states &#8220;We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.&#8221; There are no exclusions here boys and girls. As a gay man, I am a tax paying citizen of this country, tracing my family back to pre white man arriving on these shores. Give it a rest folks. For those who do not wish me to have equal rights, then fine, you pay my yearly federal and state income tax bill so I DON&#8217;T have to pay for yours. End of story.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Carter</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-225483</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Carter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 16:22:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-225483</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept http://bit.ly/fl89q&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/mfcarterdesign/status/4345323287&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept <a href="http://bit.ly/fl89q" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/fl89q</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/mfcarterdesign/status/4345323287">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277">Topsy page</a>]</div>
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		<title>By: mfcarterdesign</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-233125</link>
		<dc:creator>mfcarterdesign</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 16:22:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-233125</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept http://bit.ly/fl89q&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept <a href="http://bit.ly/fl89q" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/fl89q</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Eclectic Radical</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-223729</link>
		<dc:creator>Eclectic Radical</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 12:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-223729</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s dangerous to overestimate the influence that seeing individuals instead of &#039;gays as a class&#039; will have on most of the right. For all the faults and foibles and flaws of Bush&#039;s character, he is a fairly simple &#039;good guy&#039; on a purely individual level. He genuinely believes some truly oafish and dangerous things, but he is not a &#039;bad&#039; man. He is a misguided, spoiled man who doesn&#039;t understand how the real world operates.
 
There are a lot of people, especially on the religious right, who do not see individuals at all  In situations where we would see the individual harm, they simply see &#039;sinners as a class&#039; and their view of sin and forgiveness is decidely twisted from basic Christian principle.
 
Furthermore, because some of this people do not live in the real world with the rest of us, their perceptions can be badly twisted even when they do see &#039;individuals.&#039; Bobby Jindal did not see an epileptic girl having a seizure and call the campus medical service or an ambulance... he saw an attack of demonic position and exorcized the girl even as she may have needed real medical help. As an epileptic myself, I find that terribly worrisome.
 
So I don&#039;t have a great deal of faith in a sea change in the way we see individuals nor see that sea change influencing the gay rights issue. I am a little less pessimistic about the future than Sullivan, if &lt;strong&gt;Iowa &lt;/strong&gt;can recognize gay marriage through state legislation then I think there&#039;s still hope. I understand exactly why he feels the way he does, though, in his situation and with his unfortunate conflux of political views and personal circumstances.


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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s dangerous to overestimate the influence that seeing individuals instead of &#8216;gays as a class&#8217; will have on most of the right. For all the faults and foibles and flaws of Bush&#8217;s character, he is a fairly simple &#8216;good guy&#8217; on a purely individual level. He genuinely believes some truly oafish and dangerous things, but he is not a &#8216;bad&#8217; man. He is a misguided, spoiled man who doesn&#8217;t understand how the real world operates.<br />
 <br />
There are a lot of people, especially on the religious right, who do not see individuals at all  In situations where we would see the individual harm, they simply see &#8216;sinners as a class&#8217; and their view of sin and forgiveness is decidely twisted from basic Christian principle.<br />
 <br />
Furthermore, because some of this people do not live in the real world with the rest of us, their perceptions can be badly twisted even when they do see &#8216;individuals.&#8217; Bobby Jindal did not see an epileptic girl having a seizure and call the campus medical service or an ambulance&#8230; he saw an attack of demonic position and exorcized the girl even as she may have needed real medical help. As an epileptic myself, I find that terribly worrisome.<br />
 <br />
So I don&#8217;t have a great deal of faith in a sea change in the way we see individuals nor see that sea change influencing the gay rights issue. I am a little less pessimistic about the future than Sullivan, if <strong>Iowa </strong>can recognize gay marriage through state legislation then I think there&#8217;s still hope. I understand exactly why he feels the way he does, though, in his situation and with his unfortunate conflux of political views and personal circumstances.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Smith</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-627045</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 08:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-627045</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Frank Sides</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-627046</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Sides</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 08:17:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-627046</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/2x8J57&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/2x8J57" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/2x8J57</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention » Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept Liberal Values -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-223709</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention » Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept Liberal Values -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 06:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-223709</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Mike Smith , Mike Smith , GLBT World News, Frank Sides and others. Frank Sides said: » Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/2x8J57 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Mike Smith , Mike Smith , GLBT World News, Frank Sides and others. Frank Sides said: » Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/2x8J57" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/2x8J57</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: GLBT World News</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-225484</link>
		<dc:creator>GLBT World News</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 06:14:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-225484</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/VtFmx&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/glbtworldnews/status/4336165138&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/VtFmx" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/VtFmx</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/glbtworldnews/status/4336165138">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277">Topsy page</a>]</div>
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		<title>By: glbtworldnews</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-233126</link>
		<dc:creator>glbtworldnews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 06:14:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-233126</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/VtFmx&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/VtFmx" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/VtFmx</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Web Master</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-230626</link>
		<dc:creator>Web Master</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 06:07:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-230626</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/4eLoL7&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/4eLoL7" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/4eLoL7</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Web Master</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-230627</link>
		<dc:creator>Web Master</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-230627</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Mike Smith </title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-225485</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Smith </dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 05:07:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-225485</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/4eLoL7&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/gaymarriageword/status/4335222912&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/4eLoL7" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/4eLoL7</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/gaymarriageword/status/4335222912">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277">Topsy page</a>]</div>
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		<title>By: Axel Hotels</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-540522</link>
		<dc:creator>Axel Hotels</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:54:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-540522</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/2p7SQV&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/2p7SQV" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/2p7SQV</a></span></span></span></p>
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		<title>By: Mike Smith </title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-225486</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Smith </dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-225486</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/gaymarriageword/status/4334577971&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/yasqeb6</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/gaymarriageword/status/4334577971">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277">Topsy page</a>]</div>
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		<title>By: Frank Sides</title>
		<link>http://liberalvaluesblog.com/2009/09/23/repubican-congressman-sees-gay-marriage-as-socialist-concept/comment-page-1/#comment-225487</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Sides</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:17:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277#comment-225487</guid>
		<description>&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_comment&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_twitter_username&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;topsy_trackback_content&quot;&gt;» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept ... http://bit.ly/2x8J57&lt;/span&gt;
&lt;div class=&quot;topsy_trackback_links&quot;&gt;[&lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/frnd_of_dorthy/status/4334400880&quot;&gt;Original tweet&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277&quot;&gt;Topsy page&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="topsy_trackback_comment"><span class="topsy_twitter_username"><span class="topsy_trackback_content">» Republican Congressman Sees Gay Marriage As Socialist Concept &#8230; <a href="http://bit.ly/2x8J57" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/2x8J57</a></span></p>
<div class="topsy_trackback_links">[<a href="http://twitter.com/frnd_of_dorthy/status/4334400880">Original tweet</a>, <a href="http://topsy.com/trackback?url=http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=10277">Topsy page</a>]</div>
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