It is amazing that any one could take Rudy Giuliani seriously after repeating the Bush line in the last debate that the terrorists attacked us because they hate us for our freedoms, totally ignoring all the geopolitical factors which led to the conflict. Anyone who looks at terrorism in such a simplistic way is not fit to manage our national security, as we’ve seen under George Bush. Rudy Giuliani, like George Bush, has tried to cover his incompetence by taking credit for accomplishments post 9/11 which he does not deserve. There have already been reports about Giuliani’s failings, including criticism by the firefighters. The New York Times reports criticism from Jerome M. Hauer, New York City’s first emergency management director:
In recent days, Mr. Hauer has challenged Mr. Giuliani’s recollection that he had little role as mayor in placing the city’s emergency command center at the ill-fated World Trade Center.
Mr. Hauer has also disputed the claim by the Giuliani campaign that the mayor’s wife, Judith Giuliani, had coordinated a help center for families after the attack.
And he has contradicted Mr. Giuliani’s assertions that the city’s emergency response was well coordinated that day, a point he made most notably to the authors of “Grand Illusion,” a book that depicts Mr. Giuliani’s antiterrorism efforts as deeply flawed.
Uh, as someone who speaks and reads Arabic, has lived in the Arab world for a decade, and has been in every country in the Arab League save Libya and Djibouti, I can attest that THE ARABS AND ISLAMISTS HATE OUR FREEDOM—especially the freedoms we give women and other religions. I studied Arabic at King Abdul-Aziz University when Osama was a student there and the non-Arab Muslims in the class with me HATED me because I was a westerner.
I know that the so-called “reality-based community” lives in a bicoastal bubble concocted by ideological Marxists, but living in the region, speaking the language, and travelling to about thirty Islamic countries in all gives me the right to say that the non-westernized Islamic elements across about 50 Islamic countries [with the exception of Indonesia and Malaysia] tend to hate the West indiscrimately and have since the fall of the Caliphate.
And it isn’t the US’s fault that those retards hate us! And anyone with “liberal” credentials shouldn’t be giving these violent reactionaries an even break!
You can continue your mindless Giuliani-bashing agenda now.
That is a gross over-simplification. They wouldn’t hate you simply because you are a westerner if there weren’t other factors involved
The most mindless thing here is your attributing anything to ideolgical Marxists as you display a total lack of knowledge about the topic.
Nobody has said that it is the fault of the US and I haven’t seen any liberals giving the terrorist any sort of break. It is just a sign of the incoherence of the conservative position that you have to resort to such smears to cover your lack of understanding of the problem and the failure of Republican policies on terrorism. When you have to resort to distorting the opposing position in such a manner you only discredit yourself.
Having spent a lot fo time in the ME, there is some truth to the hate us for our freedoms story. It has to do with our emancipation of women. In strict Muslim areas, women are treated as cattle or as breedmares. In more modern areas, women have more rights in choosing careers and deciding to have children.
But they really hate us for supporting repressive regimes that murder their own people while giving lipservice to Democracy and integrity. We are despised for being hypocritical.
A perfect example is Iran. I was in Iran prior to the overthrow and Iran was almost two countries. The Shah tried to modernize Iran and tried to change the treatment of women. However, he had a vicious secret police that would imprison and tortue folks at will. In fact, they were my customer. When we support brutal dictators like that, we support the treatment of their subjects.
Yes, the hate our freedoms. I don’t think we can deny that, but to say that alone is what prompted the terrorists acts against us is ridiculous. TO understand is not to excuse, but to go into battle informed. Bush clearly is not informed. For one thing, they hate us giving women freedoms and power, so what the heck do we send Condoleeza Rice in there for? Unbelievably stupid diplomacy. Actually, Bush has eschewed diplomacy almost entirely in this war. Our tactics are increasing the size and strength of our enemy, not diminishing them. Because we refuse to try to understand their motives.
To Daveinboca: I’m curious, do you like the MIddle East and the culture? YOu seem not to. What prompted your instense study of this region? And would you agree that their hatred has been intensified by the Iraq War and by our years of intervention in that region and our support of Israel? Not to excuse it, but to understand it? Do you think what we’re doing in Iraq makes sense?
ps- I have to take exception to the ridiculous assertion that anybody who is not a republican is a Marxist. Give me a break. What American over the age of 21 would seriously declare him/herself a Marxist in this day and age. Hot air and hatred between people of opposing views does not lead to understanding. As we have seen in the Middle East.
ps — Bush is under this ideological notion that the world secretly wants our freedoms, that we’re setting the stage for democracy in Iraq. Giuliani at least knows better. Those freedoms they hate INCLUDE democracy.
Ohdear,
Plus, while they may hate our freedoms, not only is this an over simplification, but it doesn’t explan terrorist acts.
If we weren’t involved in the region, they might still hate our ideas of rights for women, etc, but most it is doubtful they would bother to launch terrorist attacks against us over this.
Another problem with the Bush idea of claiming he is spreading democracy is that this gives democracy a bad name in the area. Democracy advocates in nondemocratic countries now report having problems where people see how we “brought democracy” to Iraq and they want no part of this.
Dave is certainly rather absurd for equating any disagreement with current Republican policies, even on non-economic matters, as Marxists. I doubt you could find many Marxists left in this country.
i hate the support 4 israel argument. yes we support israel the russians support the arabs and so what. israelis dominate that region and dont need our help.muslims need to look at their own goverments who let us and want us in their land.we saved the middle east from saddam becomming king of middle east and now were not welcome cause israel is stronger and your gov let us stay. f that. they kill anything non muslim if we werent around it would be someone else. so brinbg it on
and condi is our sec of state if they have a prob w her being a women they should go pray 4 forgivness